One of the dumbest arguments for the existence of god, yet one of the most popular among believers and it works on people who haven't thought too deep about it too. Hell, it even worked on me for a while. As I previously said, I was raised catholic, barely, but still I had a belief in god and yes, even the jesus character that people seem to like so damn much. Like pretty much all christian cults (they're all cults in my words by the way), I never thought about god more than jesus, I was so confused at whether or not it was the same guy anyway or his father or if they shared a condo somewhere in Florida.
Now, Pascal's Wager is this neat little thing that makes the most sense to a believer. It's about the only thing that kept me believing in jesus even after I had pretty much confirmed that my doubts about the religion were true. Blaise Pascal, a french philosopher from the 17th century, proposed that believing in god made the most sense since it's a win-win situation. How the hell did he get to that conclusion? I don't know, I never said he was a competent philosopher. Also, he had a near-death experience a few years before writing his "Wager" in which he had a vision from no other than the christian god. (It reminds me I have to explain why near-death experiences are meaningless at some point in the future.)
The win-win situation he's talking about is that if you live your life according to god's principles (which about no one comes close to achieving anyway), you have everything to win and it's not like you're losing something in doing that. On the other hand, not believing in god if he turns out to be true is a pretty poor decision when you think about it with not only nothing to gain, but a hell of a lot to lose. Of course, all of this assumes in Pascal's case that it's the christian god that's real, that the bible tells the truth about him and that burning in hell is an actual possibility for not believing in jesus.
So we live in 2010 now and it should be pretty obvious to anyone that it would be more surprising than anything if the christian turned out to be true (or just about any god actually), but it isn't. Now I'll start by assuming that yes, jesus is real and I obviously don't believe in him, so yeah I'm destined to burn in hell after my death somewhat. All you christians are laughing right now, aren't you? We can't just talk about the "christian belief" anymore though, so are you a true christian? Of course you are! So what are you? Catholic, protestant, mormon, jehovah's witness, moonie? What's a true christian anyway, because you know that not only do you have to believe in jesus, but if you choose the wrong branch, some members do think you go to hell. Even members from the same branch might think you go to hell, ask a fundamentalist and you'll see. Truly everybody thinks they're going to heaven, everybody and their loved ones that is, but that certainty is lost for anyone else in their eyes.
Pascal's Wager is a scary game when you think about it, because each religion and subdivision is most of the time mutually exclusive. Maybe South Park was right when they jokingly said the mormons were right, it means all of you other types of christians would be wrong. Anyway, one thing is certain, no matter who wins, most of the planet is wrong. Now, just for a second, let's say that the god depicted in the qur'an is the right one. I know that to be respectful, christians will sometimes say things such as judeo-christian beliefs, also including Allah when they truly want to look good on tv. Even though it's debatable, yes the god of muslim is supposed to be the same one the jews and christians worship. But unless you're a really nice christian I guess, you think the muslim is wrong for not believing in jesus and he will go to hell. Same thing for the muslims who think that if you don't live your life according to the principles of the qur'an (which you don't if you're not a muslim), you're going to jahannam, their particular version of hell. Now it's an even scarier game, because you could be wrong if you choose the wrong branch of christianity, but also if you choose christianity over islam or vice-versa.
You do know there are even more religions than that and the most popular ones have their own versions of hell. They often have the decency of being nicer though, such as hinduism where you stand trial and are given the appropriate punishment (which is truly horrible, but not eternal), but still being the true believer in each particular religion is supposed to have a reward at the end. Here's a nice one for you, what if god put all these false religions on the planet to see who would be smart enough to avoid them. After all, nobody wants to spend eternity with a blind believer. That would be incredibly annoying for the next 9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 years and still counting. Maybe the skeptics and atheists are rewarded while the believers are obliterated of something like that. Of course, I'm not truly enjoying this fantasy, it was just to piss you off believers and to show you how dumb Pascal's Wagers truly is. I don't see why I should enjoy some infinite reward and I don't see why even Hitler should still be burning in hell even in a million years from now for what he did, and we all know it was very wrong. (By the way, not that I like pointing it out, but Hitler was a christian. Of course, I'm not dumb enough to use it as an argument against christians, I don't need that and most of the time they just say he wasn't a true christian. I'm just saying it so that nobody says he was an atheist as they always do.)
So in my scenario, all believers were losers, which is the first step in pointing out how dumb Pascal was when he made his suggestion. But did he say anything true at all? No! As I said, he was suggesting that for the christian god, based on the same validity of proof as any other god, blind faith (a pleonasm). So only if his god is true did he tell the truth. Now let's evaluate this win-win situations. Let's assume for a moment there truly is no god, not even the atheist version I just invented for fun. You die in a natural world where your brain (which contained everything that was your personnality, or just "you") begins to rot until nothing is left. No electricity in your body, you just stopped working. Kinda like you think a rock has no soul, the rotting body left behind is just flesh. Now let's say you were a christian, though it works with any faith.
If you were a strong believer in christianity your whole life. You might have a profound hate for homosexuals, which means you're just an evil moron on that point if there's no god. You also might think that sex itself is a sin if you're enjoying it, some people struggle with that especially during their adolescence. There are always those who practice self-mutilation to punish themselves for their sins, but I won't count those because they're quite rare. I think the most damage is done emotionnally and psychologically. Some branches of christianity are also against condoms, causing higher teen pregnancy. If all that shit about god is not real, what do you look like right now? You're not winning anything, you're just not enjoying your life as it is to the fullest.
To close this, here is a brilliant comment apparently made by Marcus Aurelius (I'm not certain): "Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but...will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones."
Showing posts with label Thoughts. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Thoughts. Show all posts
Saturday, May 1, 2010
Thursday, April 29, 2010
Suicide
Since I just made a post about a crappy day, I decided to write one about suicide. No, don't worry, I never had any thoughts about taking my own life and probably never will, although I'm not trying to say all atheists are the same. Atheist, believer, whatever, I think that when you get to a point where you commit suicide, it's because something was really messed up in your brain. In other words, we should help people like that, but if they kill themselves, it was probably not a rational choice at the moment, it was not their fault (yet, some believers will tell you that it's a sin).
I sincerely believe that being a believer is harmful to you in that kind of situation. If you have a succession of bad things happening to you at one point and god doesn't help you, you're going to think he doesn't care about you. It makes you feel even worse about yourself, because now you think you're a piece of shit in the eyes of the perfect being who made you and who is supposed to care about everyone. Also, when it comes to the time of ending your life for real, some people will panic at the last minute and seek for help. One who truly believes that there's an afterlife will be more inclined to do it. After all, if you shoot a bullet through your brain, you appear dead on Earth, but your soul is released to go to an infinitely better place.
Of course, that's where beliefs are not shared by everyone. There's the branch of believers (let's take christians, I know them better) who say that no matter what, if you believe in Jesus he forgave you and you go with him in his kingdom to suck his cock or I don't know what (some go as far as to say that if you've been saved once, you're saved forever.) There's the other branch which thinks you go burn in hell, even if you just had a mental breakdown. Yeah, you can really feel the love of god now, can't you? There's a thinner branch of believers who don't believe in hell, but in some kind of separation from god for people who didn't obey the rules (hey, that includes me), which is still bad considering that other people are rewarded with infinite pleasure just for believing in the right thing.
None of that matters for the believer to stop him from killing himself. After all, if you've been raised a christian all your life, you think that humanity is worthless. We are all guilty of the original sin, a truly sick concept, but thankfully god sent his son or himself or I don't know (the trinity is not only a complex concept that nobody can really explain, but not all christians even believe in it) to be the ultimate sacrifice. All I'm saying is that the person who thinks god had abandoned her, the person who goes as far as taking her own life having been raised a christian, well maybe that person thinks she deserves to go to hell and kills herself to get the right punition.
Of course, I know that not all people are like that, but it's a dangerous thought. As a believer and a parent, you think it's good to teach your religion to your children. Most of the time, the child of a believer ends up being the same kind of believer, but there are exceptions like me. Now think about it, especially if the god you're talking about is not real. Think about the dangerous ideas you're propagating for something that has never been proven. Think of how you could grow up to be a good moral person only using rationality like me. That's beneficial since you understand better the natural world you live in and you are less likely to get other false ideas. Think it's impossible to be a moral atheist? Think again!
I sincerely believe that being a believer is harmful to you in that kind of situation. If you have a succession of bad things happening to you at one point and god doesn't help you, you're going to think he doesn't care about you. It makes you feel even worse about yourself, because now you think you're a piece of shit in the eyes of the perfect being who made you and who is supposed to care about everyone. Also, when it comes to the time of ending your life for real, some people will panic at the last minute and seek for help. One who truly believes that there's an afterlife will be more inclined to do it. After all, if you shoot a bullet through your brain, you appear dead on Earth, but your soul is released to go to an infinitely better place.
Of course, that's where beliefs are not shared by everyone. There's the branch of believers (let's take christians, I know them better) who say that no matter what, if you believe in Jesus he forgave you and you go with him in his kingdom to suck his cock or I don't know what (some go as far as to say that if you've been saved once, you're saved forever.) There's the other branch which thinks you go burn in hell, even if you just had a mental breakdown. Yeah, you can really feel the love of god now, can't you? There's a thinner branch of believers who don't believe in hell, but in some kind of separation from god for people who didn't obey the rules (hey, that includes me), which is still bad considering that other people are rewarded with infinite pleasure just for believing in the right thing.
None of that matters for the believer to stop him from killing himself. After all, if you've been raised a christian all your life, you think that humanity is worthless. We are all guilty of the original sin, a truly sick concept, but thankfully god sent his son or himself or I don't know (the trinity is not only a complex concept that nobody can really explain, but not all christians even believe in it) to be the ultimate sacrifice. All I'm saying is that the person who thinks god had abandoned her, the person who goes as far as taking her own life having been raised a christian, well maybe that person thinks she deserves to go to hell and kills herself to get the right punition.
Of course, I know that not all people are like that, but it's a dangerous thought. As a believer and a parent, you think it's good to teach your religion to your children. Most of the time, the child of a believer ends up being the same kind of believer, but there are exceptions like me. Now think about it, especially if the god you're talking about is not real. Think about the dangerous ideas you're propagating for something that has never been proven. Think of how you could grow up to be a good moral person only using rationality like me. That's beneficial since you understand better the natural world you live in and you are less likely to get other false ideas. Think it's impossible to be a moral atheist? Think again!
So I had a crappy day...
and you have no idea how much I love life (no sarcasm intended). I really mean that and without any support from God. I won't give the reasons why I had a crappy day, it's not too serious compared to other people's lives, I got over it, and it's not important for the point I'm trying to make.
How do you get over something bad happening in your life if you're a strong believer like Fred Phelps? I guess you do nothing else but pray to god and masturbate when you see heathens die of natural catastrophes like a tornado or an earthquake. In summary, you get better, but just because you're a sick retarded freak, not because of a god (by the way, notice that we call these NATURAL catastrophes.) I bet that overall, your life is not as happy as mine or anybody else's, including moderate believers.
How do you get over something bad happening in your life if you're the regular moderate believer? The answer might surprise you, but I think your experience is pretty similar to mine. Sure, at the realization of the "bad" thing in question you must have a moment for god, because only a perfect being looking out for you could resolve your Earthly problems far too big for a simple human mind. After that loss of time, you relax a bit. Then you think about the situation and you find a solution. That last bit is exactly what I do and it works. Then you thank god for it.
Why would I say the praying bit is a "loss of time"? Well, as I said, I skip that step and I get the same results. If it was so great, I guess you could skip the thinking bit and god would still resolve all your problems if you're good enough. Anyway, what I'm getting at is that if I get the same results without god and all you do is add a step to get nothing better than me, then maybe that was an unnecessary step and furthermore, I would add that it's all in your head.
Now, the time has come for a fundamentalist to say that if I rejected god and still get success, then the devil has helped me. How can I prove or disprove that? You're just making stuff up along the way. I didn't ask for god, but I didn't ask for satan either. If satan is helping me, don't you think god should do something about it? If I need to ask for god's help while satan offers his for free, no contract implied, maybe he's the good guy. Note that I don't think that at all, I remember that I don't believe in satan any more than god. I'm saying that so that someone who doesn't understand hypotheticals doesn't come later to tell me: "See! Right there! You're admitting that satan is helping you and that you think he's a good guy!"
The one who surprises me the most is the atheist who comes and tells me: "Why harass these people, they're not doing any harm." First of all, yes they're doing harm. I think nobody argues that fundamentalism is plain dangerous. I'll also agree that because of the difference of culture and laws, a muslim fundamentalist is more dangerous than a christian fundamentalist (the christian is obsessed about being able to act on his beliefs though). But don't tell me that these people are in another league and that the moderate christian, for example, is okay. For fundamentalism to exist, there are moderate believers giving it credibility. There are moderate believers who don't speak against it. There are even moderate believers who stay at home praying for fundamentalists to stop being so cruel (even though they're following their religion even more accurately) and we all know how effective prayer is, am I right?
Just believing in something supernatural that might not even exist is dangerous from the start. You probably value life less, because you think something greater is waiting for you in the afterlife. If you're an homosexual believer (I'm not, but I have nothing against them), you're probably struggling with yourself thinking that you're committing a sin. Society in general doesn't approve of you, that includes some moderates. If you're a believer, you might also wait a little more when you're sick, thinking that god will help you. It's all these little things and a long list of things I didn't talk about that add up and make it less healthy to be a person of faith, even moderately. If you live your whole life with no problems at all, I still think there might've been missed opportunities and an incredible loss of time if you were a believer, but fine, I'm not forcing you to give up your beliefs. Just think...
How do you get over something bad happening in your life if you're a strong believer like Fred Phelps? I guess you do nothing else but pray to god and masturbate when you see heathens die of natural catastrophes like a tornado or an earthquake. In summary, you get better, but just because you're a sick retarded freak, not because of a god (by the way, notice that we call these NATURAL catastrophes.) I bet that overall, your life is not as happy as mine or anybody else's, including moderate believers.
How do you get over something bad happening in your life if you're the regular moderate believer? The answer might surprise you, but I think your experience is pretty similar to mine. Sure, at the realization of the "bad" thing in question you must have a moment for god, because only a perfect being looking out for you could resolve your Earthly problems far too big for a simple human mind. After that loss of time, you relax a bit. Then you think about the situation and you find a solution. That last bit is exactly what I do and it works. Then you thank god for it.
Why would I say the praying bit is a "loss of time"? Well, as I said, I skip that step and I get the same results. If it was so great, I guess you could skip the thinking bit and god would still resolve all your problems if you're good enough. Anyway, what I'm getting at is that if I get the same results without god and all you do is add a step to get nothing better than me, then maybe that was an unnecessary step and furthermore, I would add that it's all in your head.
Now, the time has come for a fundamentalist to say that if I rejected god and still get success, then the devil has helped me. How can I prove or disprove that? You're just making stuff up along the way. I didn't ask for god, but I didn't ask for satan either. If satan is helping me, don't you think god should do something about it? If I need to ask for god's help while satan offers his for free, no contract implied, maybe he's the good guy. Note that I don't think that at all, I remember that I don't believe in satan any more than god. I'm saying that so that someone who doesn't understand hypotheticals doesn't come later to tell me: "See! Right there! You're admitting that satan is helping you and that you think he's a good guy!"
The one who surprises me the most is the atheist who comes and tells me: "Why harass these people, they're not doing any harm." First of all, yes they're doing harm. I think nobody argues that fundamentalism is plain dangerous. I'll also agree that because of the difference of culture and laws, a muslim fundamentalist is more dangerous than a christian fundamentalist (the christian is obsessed about being able to act on his beliefs though). But don't tell me that these people are in another league and that the moderate christian, for example, is okay. For fundamentalism to exist, there are moderate believers giving it credibility. There are moderate believers who don't speak against it. There are even moderate believers who stay at home praying for fundamentalists to stop being so cruel (even though they're following their religion even more accurately) and we all know how effective prayer is, am I right?
Just believing in something supernatural that might not even exist is dangerous from the start. You probably value life less, because you think something greater is waiting for you in the afterlife. If you're an homosexual believer (I'm not, but I have nothing against them), you're probably struggling with yourself thinking that you're committing a sin. Society in general doesn't approve of you, that includes some moderates. If you're a believer, you might also wait a little more when you're sick, thinking that god will help you. It's all these little things and a long list of things I didn't talk about that add up and make it less healthy to be a person of faith, even moderately. If you live your whole life with no problems at all, I still think there might've been missed opportunities and an incredible loss of time if you were a believer, but fine, I'm not forcing you to give up your beliefs. Just think...
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